Synth Wave. Cold Wave. Electro. Techno. EBM. Just some of the labels others have used to categorise Zanias‘ music. However if you ask the Berlin-based artist and label-head herself, she simply cuts through the noise and proudly replies, ‘Pop.’ “I think fear of being cheesy was a huge creative block for me in my twenties,”she explains, “but now I’ve unequivocally broken free of that.”

Mixing the coldness of her adoptive city with the lush, restorative energy of her family home in Queensland, Zanias’ third album, Chrysalis, is a journey through the dark to the light. Having recently buried a family member, while also surviving her own near-death experience, Zanias dealt with both these traumatic events the only way she knew how – by making great music. “I want to dedicate more time to just making music. That is my greatest joy, being alone deep in my world.”

Loverboy spoke with Zanias about the intense six months that resulted in Chrysalis, her Berlin musical family and running her label Fleisch.

First things first, how are we pronouncing Zanias?
I just say Zanias (Zan-yas). It is Greek. It’s one of my best friend’s last names, and the result of an ongoing joke from many years ago!

What does he think of it?
It’s a bit bizarre but he’s proud of it. He attended my first gig ever (as Linea Aspera) and been a huge supporter of my music from the very beginning, and is an artist himself. He encouraged me to start the solo project in the first place.

Haha…amazing. And do you see Zanias as a character?
Oh, it’s very much me. But to be clear: I’m a very private person. I don’t enjoy the spotlight. I’m neurodivergent and highly sensitive. So I did try to separate myself by coming up with a ‘stage name’ but then at the same time, perhaps related to the neurodivergence, I just can’t be anything but me. I’ve got an almost pathological attachment to the truth and can’t pretend otherwise, and honestly authenticity is so vital in music so it’s philosophically necessary for me to embed myself in it. And of course it’s also the most ‘me’ because for recent years it’s almost exclusively been me working on it (aside from some bass contributions from my new bandmate!).

And so we come to Chrysalis.
Yes, this album was created entirely by accident. There was no plan. One day I was looking through my demos and was like, ‘Oh, I have an album.’ I’d written all but one of the songs within a six month period where I had experienced a death in the family, decided to quit music, moved all my stuff back to Australia, lost my flat in Berlin, got broken up with very unceremoniously, then decided to stay in Berlin and had to find a new place to live….and had a near-death experience as well.

What??
It was quite well publicised at the time, but I nearly died at a nightclub in a ridiculously controversial spiking incident.

Jesus. I’m sorry to hear that. What was the aftermath?
It was very heavy. The worst part was the attention I got, both the good and the bad. I honestly wish I hadn’t posted anything about it, but I was so scared of it happening again and someone not being as lucky as I was and surviving, so I did what I thought was right based on the evidence I had at the time. Everyone around me was pressuring me hard to say something and I was totally overwhelmed with the aftermath of the psychedelic horror trip that the mystery drugs had induced so I just did what I was told.

Oh my God.
The whole thing was too much, but part of the healing process was writing the song ‘Closing’ about it. It’s very specifically about the incident, but also about the general isolation of trauma. When you’ve gone through something, no matter how much people try to be there for you, they can’t because they haven’t experienced the same thing. So anyway… It was a very difficult year and the way that I dealt with that was by making music.

When you play the songs live now, do you relive the trauma?
No, playing them is cathartic. I’ll often cry. What I love about playing live is that I sometimes find new meanings in old songs, depending on what’s going on in my life at the time. What’s nice about touring with Laura is that we often discuss what we’re feeling through the set and what the songs are doing for us. We both get this kind of therapeutic effect that changes over time.

My favourite track is a darker one. I really love ‘Burial.’
That one is about burying someone you love. The period right after, when you have to build a new world without that person in it. I had flown back to Australia to be there when someone I loved died and people were angry at me for cancelling tour dates, even though I had told them a family member was ill. I wanted privacy but because of that they were questioning if I was lying. I couldn’t believe the insensitivity, and it was just really hard to feel like I had disappointed everyone over something that was already so heartbreaking and scary. So yes,  ‘Burial’ is a heavy one. It’s also the first song I wrote after I decided to quit music, hence “I can’t seem to do this anymore” and “I’m not even sorry I disappeared”. I thought I was finished.

Which is your favourite right now?
The track that left me feeling elated most recently was ‘Lovelife’ which has the least lyrics. But I played it at KHIDI and there was such a euphoric moment on the dancefloor, I saw tears on people’s faces and the lighting was so ethereal and haunting. It had almost felt like the least ‘deeply meaningful’ track on the album and when I played it that night it suddenly all made sense. I will never forget that moment.

When it comes to production, what were you looking forward to trying out this time?
Definitely doing different things with my vocals, like layering, chops and pitching. When I started out, the men I was working with didn’t want me doing too much to my vocals, and that affected me way more deeply than it should have. So on Chrysalis I finally departed from that ridiculous restriction. I also incorporated an acoustic guitar which I never thought I’d ever do. I guess the technique this time was just “doing whatever I want with no barriers”. And interestingly most of this album was written when I was convinced I didn’t want a music career anymore, so I was making this album entirely for myself and no one else. Any subconscious expectations of my audience were out the window, and I think that was really helpful.

I’ve seen you using the word pop to describe Chrysalis. A rhetorical question but is pop a dirty word?
I think of pop as any music that is made to actually sound good. Some artists just have different goals, like ‘how do I make this sound weird/abrasive/confronting?’. But pop is comfortable to listen to because it’s beautifully made, and it isn’t afraid of expressing emotion, of being potentially ‘cheesy’. I think fear of being cheesy was a huge creative block for me in my twenties but now I’ve unequivocally broken free of that.

I love that. Some people get so hung up on different genres. The gatekeeping of it all!
I think that is all such a load of bullshit. I’m all about breaking down the genre barriers. I don’t even know what genre I am! Like I really struggle with understanding genre at all (a neurodivergent trait or just not caring enough? Who knows…). We live in a post-genre world and the idea of gatekeeping a genre is anti-Art. Art is about creating something new. If you are trying to fit something into a box then you’re not contributing, you are consuming.
I wonder if it is related to capitalism and the way everyone is just totally fine with stuff just sounding the same just for the sake of its marketability. I think that is so philosophically and morally wrong. I’m very much a believer in Terence McKenna’s philosophies, that ‘Nature loves courage’ and ‘The universe craves novelty.’

You’ve previously said, ‘I never want to be too stable or predictable.’ You and I have both moved around in our childhoods and then actually as adults too. Do you feel that instability is your comfort zone now?
Exactly. Growing up as an international child, it’s just the water we swim in. Instability is what we feel most comfortable with, even when it feels uncomfortable. It’s also very inspiring for me to have lots of changes. I am really forced to confront myself in every single big transition. Even just coming back from Australia to Berlin…

How has this affected your music?
I think it’s made me quite fearless in what I am willing to make and how I operate. I allow myself to just go for what I want to do and not worry too much about the consequences…or genre! Once you’ve seen so much of the world you realise that all these boxes we create are just total illusions.

I imagine the contrast between Berlin & Queensland must be immense.
They are definitely polar opposites. Queensland is so sunny and my family live on a property where they grow their own vegetables and have rainwater tanks and solar power. Every evening we walk the dogs up a hill past about 30 kangaroos while the kookaburras sing. It’s very cut off from civilisation. When I go back there, it’s just me, my family and the forest (and the wildlife, which I love so so much).
Then my time in Berlin is spent interacting with so many different people and there’s very little nature to be enjoyed. Not many birds…but then the music world and my amazing friends have kept me tied to this city. We’re a crew of introverted weirdos from all over the world who have found each other in this strange city. They are what’s kept me here.

You’re buddies with Phase Fatale and Pablo Bozzi who we both also love. How did you all come to know each other?
Me and Hayden moved to Berlin around the same time (10 years ago!!). I remember meeting him for the first time at an Automelodi show when he was playing live with them. Fantastic band. He lived with the ex-boyfriend of my current flatmate, in the same building as some Australian friends of mine, if that gives an idea of how tied together our little world is! Then we were all part of the Fleisch crew when it first started. We’ve been together through this whole Berlin journey. He came over to check the test pressing of his first techno record on my turntable and I remember thinking “Awww, this kid’s making techno now. So cute”. Then Pablo joined our world a few years ago through Imperial Black Unit, and I also put out their music on Fleisch (their collaboration with another best friend of mine, Reka). When Hayden put out his first EP on BITE I realised we had a very special producer in our midst!

How’re things going at Fleisch at the moment?
Fleisch right now is really just me releasing my own work, and friends’ work when I have time. This year it was ULTRA SUNN & Neu-Romancer. There might be a few more friends I have in the queue, but I’m not trying to put something out every few months the way I used to. It’s more of a hobby now.

Does the concept of business detract from your enjoyment of it?
Yes, it detracts a lot out of the entire job. At the same time the thought of handing the business side over to someone else scares me because I’m a massive control freak, and also reasonably good at it. I really want to dedicate more time to just making music because that is my greatest joy, being alone deep in my world.

And what’s this about a new album on the way already?
Yes, it’s just been mixed! It hasn’t been mastered yet and I still have to do the artwork. I would say that the earliest release would be September. It’s way more experimental and weird. It’s as if Dead Can Dance listened to Clams Casino and wrote an album specifically for tripping on 5-meo-DMT. I’m very excited but I can’t say too much more than that.

Lastly we are named after the biggest-selling single of 2001 so always ask, what is your favourite Mariah Carey single?
Oh my God. I am not familiar enough with Mariah to answer this. But actually I do have a favourite. When I was five years old, my Mum bought me ‘Music Box’ on cassette tape and ‘Dreamlover’ is the first track on it so it’s the one I’m most familiar with. I was more of a Madonna girl. ‘Open Your Heart’. ‘Into The Groove.’ But ‘Frozen’ was the one that sent me down the goth path… one glimpse of all that black billowing in the wind and my fate was sealed. I’m now the most colourful I’ve ever been since that day.

Chrysalis is out now on Fleisch Records
Imagery by Hidrico Rubens